Who Are We?

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-24, 18:36

That is my question. Who are we, as individuals, as a race, as a country, where do we stand? Why do we stand there? Why is it society dictates the individual? I want to hear everybody's thoughts on that question, and ponder it good.

by Shemuel 2008-07-24, 19:00

I see humanity as a tree. Our nationalities/regionalities are branches. We are leaves fitting into humanity and at the same time our different cultures, while being an individual.

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-24, 19:02

that's a neat way of looking at it. it almost seems like it would be a chineese view of the world

by Shemuel 2008-07-24, 19:05

There we are then. What do you think?

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-24, 19:08

something to think about, that's for certain

by Darkjedi 2008-07-25, 08:21

Darkwing wrote:Why is it society dictates the individual?

In order to answer that question, we have to think about who controls society......
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A VITAL ISSUE IS RAISED

When Satan led Adam and Eve into disobeying Jehovah, (you know, by eating the forbidden fruit) an important question was raised. Satan did not call into question Jehovah’s power. Even Satan knows that there is no limit to Jehovah’s power. Rather, Satan questioned Jehovah’s right to rule. By calling God a liar who withholds good from his subjects, Satan charged that Jehovah is a bad ruler. (Genesis 3:2-5) Satan implied that mankind would be better off without God’s rulership. This was an attack on Jehovah’s sovereignty, his right to rule.

Adam and Eve rebelled against Jehovah. In effect, they said: “We do not need Jehovah as our Ruler. We can decide for ourselves what is right and what is wrong.” How could Jehovah settle that issue? How could he teach all intelligent creatures that the rebels were wrong and that his way truly is best? Someone might say that God should simply have destroyed the rebels and made a fresh start. But Jehovah had stated his purpose to fill the earth with the offspring of Adam and Eve, and he wanted them to live in an earthly paradise. (Genesis 1:28) Jehovah always fulfills his purposes. (Isaiah 55:10, 11) Besides that, getting rid of the rebels in Eden would not have answered the question that had been raised regarding Jehovah’s right to rule.

Let us consider an illustration. Imagine that a teacher is telling his students how to solve a difficult problem. A clever but rebellious student claims that the teacher’s way of solving the problem is wrong. Implying that the teacher is not capable, this rebel insists that he knows a much better way to solve the problem. Some students think that he is right, and they also become rebellious. What should the teacher do? If he throws the rebels out of the class, what will be the effect on the other students? Will they not believe that their fellow student and those who joined him are right? All the other students in the class might lose respect for the teacher, thinking that he is afraid of being proved wrong. But suppose that the teacher allows the rebel to show the class how he would solve the problem.

Jehovah has done something similar to what the teacher does. Remember that the rebels in Eden were not the only ones involved. Millions of angels were watching. (Job 38:7; Daniel 7:10) How Jehovah handled the rebellion would greatly affect all those angels and eventually all intelligent creation. So, what has Jehovah done? He has allowed Satan to show how he would rule mankind. God has also allowed humans to govern themselves under Satan’s guidance.

The teacher in our illustration knows that the rebel and the students on his side are wrong. But he also knows that allowing them the opportunity to try to prove their point will benefit the whole class. When the rebels fail, all honest students will see that the teacher is the only one qualified to lead the class. They will understand why the teacher thereafter removes any rebels from the class. Similarly, Jehovah knows that all honesthearted humans and angels will benefit from seeing that Satan and his fellow rebels have failed and that humans cannot govern themselves. Like Jeremiah of old, they will learn this vital truth: “I well know, O Jehovah, that to earthling man his way does not belong. It does not belong to man who is walking even to direct his step.”—Jeremiah 10:23.
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So in other words, Satan charged God with lying and implied that Jehovah was unfair in not letting Adam and Eve decide for themselves what was right and what was wrong.. (Look where his theology has got us. LOL! War, poverty, crime, etc.) So, God says: 'Ok, fine. Let's see how your idea works. :eye roll:'
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WHO RULES THIS WORLD?

Jesus never doubted that Satan is the ruler of this world. In some miraculous way, Satan once showed Jesus “all the kingdoms of the world and their glory.” Satan then promised Jesus: “All these things I will give you if you fall down and do an act of worship to me.” (Matthew 4:8, 9; Luke 4:5, 6) Think about this. Would that offer have been a temptation to Jesus if Satan was not the ruler of these kingdoms? Jesus did not deny that all these worldly governments were Satan’s. Surely, Jesus would have done that if Satan was not the power behind them.

Of course, Jehovah is the Almighty God, the Creator of the marvelous universe. (Revelation 4:11) Yet, nowhere does the Bible say that either Jehovah God or Jesus Christ is ruler of this world. In fact, Jesus specifically referred to Satan as “the ruler of this world.” (John 12:31; 14:30; 16:11) The Bible even refers to Satan the Devil as “the god of this system of things.” (2 Corinthians 4:3, 4) Regarding this opposer, or Satan, the Christian apostle John wrote: “The whole world is lying in the power of the wicked one.”—1 John 5:19.
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THE CONCLUSION

So, as you can see, Satan rules this world. He has it under his complete control.

Well, now Satan is really ticked off because he knows that God is in fact, the only being fit to rule mankind. He knows that he only has a short period of time left before Armageddon (when he'll be destroyed) so, he's trying to take as many people down with him before he is destroyed. (Kinda like a terrorist.)

Since Satan controls the world, that means that he controls the general society. He despises, and targets those that serve god whole souled. By serving Jehovah God, they help prove that mankind can indeed be ruled by God. In return, the devil has molded this world to create traps for genuine Christians. He has taken what mankind's view of good and bad, and twisted them in attempt to defile the worshipers of God. He doesn't want ANYONE to serve God properly.

For example, many people today think that there is nothing wrong with engaging in premarital sex. Even though, the bible clearly states that it is wrong to do so. (1 Thessalonians 4:3, 1 Corinthians 6:18)

Many of these same people think that anyone that doesn't think that the bible's viewpoint is too restrictive, is insane, crazy, a religious freak! They begin to despise the people with a good moral standing, and eventually that turns into hate. All of this has been arranged almost perfectly by Satan. What was once considered normal, is now the abnormal. The abnormal, the normal. Through this method, he keeps humankind under control. He is society. He dictates the individual.
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Wow, I spent 2 hours on that. Everyone better read it!

by Shemuel 2008-07-25, 09:40

It looks like you spent two hours on it Shocked

by Earthdeath 2008-07-25, 09:43

satan rules the Earth..not for much longer, it will be mine! Twisted Evil

by Jerome Star 2008-07-25, 11:21

Wow, that was... Pretty good. What happened to you Darkjedi? Alkanosis finally got you on his side, did he? XD

Anyways, I agree with Darkjedi's statement. Though in a more 'human-based' sense, I think the world is ruled by separate governments trying to do what is best for their people and/or themselves. Probably better than the world being ruled by one corrupt dictatorship though >>;

by Shemuel 2008-07-25, 11:55

Ah, you must have registered after we had all the theological debates. Or more precisely, it was DJ and Alka having the debates and the rest of us chipped in.

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-25, 14:44

I both agree and disagree with that DJ, and here's why. I agree that God has allowed Satan to have "rule" over use, similarly to the way that he let Satan try to bring the demise of Job. But, throughout all of that, Satan never once has any control over anything. In my mind, I see a difference between control and rule. I see rule as a sort of governing if you will, and at the moment, Satan is governing the world. But, God is in control of the world and everything else. Else the world would have perished long before the son of Christ had a chance to be born. Another thing, we see things as sort of like a play. We see it all real time, as we are all characters in this play, but what we sometimes fail to realise, is that everything is predestined, and in an odd way, already happened. Satan is waiting to be defeated, yet he was already defeated before he tempted Eve into biting the apply(or fruit, whichever you prefer). And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel.” Genesis 3:15. I have a better vbersion of that somewhere, but i can't seem to find it. Anyways, I guess my point is that Satan has rule over the world, but not control.

by Darkjedi 2008-07-26, 02:05

Darkwing wrote:I both agree and disagree with that DJ, and here's why. I agree that God has allowed Satan to have "rule" over use, similarly to the way that he let Satan try to bring the demise of Job. But, throughout all of that, Satan never once has any control over anything. In my mind, I see a difference between control and rule. I see rule as a sort of governing if you will, and at the moment, Satan is governing the world. But, God is in control of the world and everything else. Else the world would have perished long before the son of Christ had a chance to be born. Another thing, we see things as sort of like a play. We see it all real time, as we are all characters in this play, but what we sometimes fail to realise, is that everything is predestined, and in an odd way, already happened. Satan is waiting to be defeated, yet he was already defeated before he tempted Eve into biting the apply(or fruit, whichever you prefer). And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel.” Genesis 3:15. I have a better vbersion of that somewhere, but i can't seem to find it. Anyways, I guess my point is that Satan has rule over the world, but not control.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I completely agree with you. I guess I misused the word control. I meant rule. You get the picture though.

Jerome Star wrote:Wow, that was... Pretty good. What happened to you Darkjedi? Alkanosis finally got you on his side, did he? XD

Anyways, I agree with Darkjedi's statement. Though in a more 'human-based' sense, I think the world is ruled by separate governments trying to do what is best for their people and/or themselves. Probably better than the world being ruled by one corrupt dictatorship though >>;

LOL! Alkanosis didn't get on my side! He got on mine! (hint: read this https://flashtrek.forumotion.co.uk/general-chat-f1/is-there-one-true-religion-t263.htm)

by Jtull 2008-07-26, 06:20

ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh blank post. pale

by Shemuel 2008-07-26, 11:48

This is what DJ said:

Darkwing wrote:I both agree and disagree with that DJ, and here's why. I agree that God has allowed Satan to have "rule" over use, similarly to the way that he let Satan try to bring the demise of Job. But, throughout all of that, Satan never once has any control over anything. In my mind, I see a difference between control and rule. I see rule as a sort of governing if you will, and at the moment, Satan is governing the world. But, God is in control of the world and everything else. Else the world would have perished long before the son of Christ had a chance to be born. Another thing, we see things as sort of like a play. We see it all real time, as we are all characters in this play, but what we sometimes fail to realise, is that everything is predestined, and in an odd way, already happened. Satan is waiting to be defeated, yet he was already defeated before he tempted Eve into biting the apply(or fruit, whichever you prefer). And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel.” Genesis 3:15. I have a better vbersion of that somewhere, but i can't seem to find it. Anyways, I guess my point is that Satan has rule over the world, but not control.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I completely agree with you. I guess I misused the word control. I meant rule. You get the picture though.

Jerome Star wrote:Wow, that was... Pretty good. What happened to you Darkjedi? Alkanosis finally got you on his side, did he? XD

Anyways, I agree with Darkjedi's statement. Though in a more 'human-based' sense, I think the world is ruled by separate governments trying to do what is best for their people and/or themselves. Probably better than the world being ruled by one corrupt dictatorship though >>;

LOL! Alkanosis didn't get on my side! He got on mine! (hint: read this https://flashtrek.forumotion.co.uk/general-chat-f1/is-there-one-true-religion-t263.htm)

by Galaxy-Scarface 2008-07-26, 11:49

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-26, 11:51

what's going on here?

by Galaxy-Scarface 2008-07-26, 11:52

We're just posting blank stuff who know why...?

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-26, 11:52

ok, well stop as it is, i don't know spam or something. anyways, it's irrelevant to the topic

by Shemuel 2008-07-26, 11:53

I tried to post DJ's post but it didn't work

by Earthdeath 2008-07-26, 12:38

im going to see if my post blanks.
EDIT: nope.

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-26, 12:39

i think it was a random fluke

by Earthdeath 2008-07-26, 12:40

yeah.any ideas on what caused it?

by **Darkwing** 2008-07-26, 12:41

technology

by Earthdeath 2008-07-26, 12:44

the horrors of tech.first microsoft and now this...

by Galaxy-Scarface 2008-07-26, 15:42

No, he hacked into it.

by leewatson1 2008-07-26, 16:39

back to topic

i think weve all been brainwashed by our goverments and when they say jump we say how high if we didnt why arnt there riots about fuel prices now we just sit there and oh the price of fuel has went up ok kids pack your bags where living with the hobo down the street like the goverments don't really care about us otherwise why don't the goverments cut tax on fuel and food we need them to live. okim done for now plz enjoy my little rants about how to make the world a better place

by Shemuel 2008-07-26, 16:41

---------> https://flashtrek.forumotion.co.uk/pandora-s-box-f33/the-anger-of-leewatson1-t506.htm

by leewatson1 2008-07-26, 17:45

yes shemul but it was releted to this topic

by Darkjedi 2008-07-27, 19:04

Wow, that was a big glitch! Here's what I wanted to post:

I both agree and disagree with that DJ, and here's why. I agree that God has allowed Satan to have "rule" over use, similarly to the way that he let Satan try to bring the demise of Job. But, throughout all of that, Satan never once has any control over anything. In my mind, I see a difference between control and rule. I see rule as a sort of governing if you will, and at the moment, Satan is governing the world. But, God is in control of the world and everything else. Else the world would have perished long before the son of Christ had a chance to be born. Another thing, we see things as sort of like a play. We see it all real time, as we are all characters in this play, but what we sometimes fail to realise, is that everything is predestined, and in an odd way, already happened. Satan is waiting to be defeated, yet he was already defeated before he tempted Eve into biting the apply(or fruit, whichever you prefer). And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel.” Genesis 3:15. I have a better vbersion of that somewhere, but i can't seem to find it. Anyways, I guess my point is that Satan has rule over the world, but not control.

Oh, don't get me wrong, I completely agree with you. He doesn't control everything, or I wouldn't be here talking to you. LOL!

Jehovah God limits Satan's power, in order to make sure that he doesn't interfere with his will.

Wow, that was... Pretty good. What happened to you Darkjedi? Alkanosis finally got you on his side, did he? XD

Anyways, I agree with Darkjedi's statement. Though in a more 'human-based' sense, I think the world is ruled by separate governments trying to do what is best for their people and/or themselves. Probably better than the world being ruled by one corrupt dictatorship though >>;

LOL! Alkanosis didn't get on my side! He got on mine! (hint: read this https://flashtrek.forumotion.co.uk/general-chat-f1/is-there-one-true-religion-t263.htm)

by Shemuel 2008-07-27, 19:13

If I was you DJ I wouldn't bother posting in this topic.

by Darkjedi 2008-07-27, 19:14

Dammit!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Huh? I thought it was broken! Well, Mods. can read what I posted by hitting the "edit" button.

by Shemuel 2008-07-27, 19:17

Yes we can. But the silence waas gratifying for a while. Razz

by Darkjedi 2008-07-27, 19:35

Did you read it then?

by Galaxy-Scarface 2008-07-27, 20:41

I did, though i am not a mod. hit the quote button.

by Darkjedi 2008-07-27, 20:59

I'll have to do this without regular quotes:

"I both agree and disagree with that DJ, and here's why. I agree that God has allowed Satan to have "rule" over use, similarly to the way that he let Satan try to bring the demise of Job. But, throughout all of that, Satan never once has any control over anything. In my mind, I see a difference between control and rule. I see rule as a sort of governing if you will, and at the moment, Satan is governing the world. But, God is in control of the world and everything else. Else the world would have perished long before the son of Christ had a chance to be born. Another thing, we see things as sort of like a play. We see it all real time, as we are all characters in this play, but what we sometimes fail to realise, is that everything is predestined, and in an odd way, already happened. Satan is waiting to be defeated, yet he was already defeated before he tempted Eve into biting the apply(or fruit, whichever you prefer). And I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers; he will crush your head, and you will strike his heel.” Genesis 3:15. I have a better vbersion of that somewhere, but i can't seem to find it. Anyways, I guess my point is that Satan has rule over the world, but not control."

- Darkwing
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I agree with you to some degree. He doesn't control everything, or I wouldn't be here talking to you. LOL! Jehovah God limits Satan's power, in order to make sure that he doesn't interfere with his will.
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"Wow, that was... Pretty good. What happened to you Darkjedi? Alkanosis finally got you on his side, did he? XD

Anyways, I agree with Darkjedi's statement. Though in a more 'human-based' sense, I think the world is ruled by separate governments trying to do what is best for their people and/or themselves. Probably better than the world being ruled by one corrupt dictatorship though >>;"

- Jerome
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LOL! Alkanosis didn't get on my side! He got on mine! (hint: read this https://flashtrek.forumotion.co.uk/general-chat-f1/is-there-one-true-religion-t263.htm)

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