North Korea Attacks South Korea

So North Korea Attacked South Korea......hmmmm, there was a battle, North Korea launched a Volly of artillary, south korea scrambled the jets, atleast one solder died, more wounded, and i predict World War 3 is going to occer.

Thoughts?

Note: There was no American intervention or influence on this according to the news.

N Korea's been definitely pushing for a war between the South. They keep testing to see how much S Korea will take before they go into full out war between each other.

and i say let them fight each other and this time let's not get involved(im talking to china too!)

I don't think South Korea wants a fight though. My interpretation has always been that they just want to be left alone, but N Korea wants the entire country and not just half of it. But I don't really follow the events that go on with regards to Korea

Well if North Korea invades South Korea, then the people that are part of the army will see what a computer is and the internet..... currently most people in North Korea dont know people have been on the moon, even that telephones exist, they dont even have eectricity, and if they invade south korea they will see, probibly causing a rebellion.

Erm... No... Alot of them have electricity. Also, i doubt the army is going to be letting them see anything that can make them want to rebel, or even tell the people at home about that stuff. Besides, the army is brainwashed to death anyway, it's not like the people would have any chance without south korea taking the north and establishing a better regime.

But the north koreans don't have a chance if they get into a war by obvious provocation. The only thing that saved them last time was china zerg rushing the UN army, this time, china is a little smarter than that. North korea would be giving south korea a slight ass kicking at the start of the war then the US and the coalition would come in and kick north koreas ass, all while china sits in the corner mumbling ''stop fig...no...wait...just...'' then giving up and going back to doing whatever it does. Like producing cheap plastic dildoes or whatever.

What if Russia gets involved, i know Russia is "Good" now, but still they do have Polands NATO Codes, they could easly ally with North Korea and Begin Ass Kicking, but i think someone else played a part in the return fire from South Korea,

lets see what they fired back with, idk Self Propelled Shells, i mean WTF, were did they get those?

There are a lot of places that sell those, and I do believe they're relatively easy to produce... Since regular artillery shells are "self propelled"...

I forget what they fired them from though, it was something really, to new to be in the Korea area....i forget what it was though, it was some Howitser

Here they talk about artillery, so... Can be...

Evil Person wrote:I forget what they fired them from though, it was something really, to new to be in the Korea area....i forget what it was though, it was some Howitser

Probably some old soviet shit or something they made in their basement.

And there's absolutely no reason for Russia to take on all of NATO plus it's allies and whoever else hates Russia. They'll probably just comment about it and go on drinking their cheap vodka and having a drunken hissy fit with their neighbours again.

South Korea ain't gonna do shit. There was this one thing a few months ago where a North Korean sub sank a South Korean ship or something and killed a bunch of people. I mean, what can they do? North Korea has tons of artillery pointed at Seoul and a full-scale war means the destruction of the less-crazy Korea.

Plus, even if they do come out and defeat North Korea, they have hordes of starving, brainwashed people. What will they do with them?

Nah, full-out war is not in the interest of either side.

The question is, what is? What is it N Korea really wants? And how does shooting at S Korea further there plan on achieving their goals?

It shows N. Korea being in a position of strength while the changeover of power occurs.... perhaps?:

Or it just proves the point that they're irrational, sociopathic dicks. Though South Korea can't do anything about it without being blown to high heaven and above.

Well... South Koreans made their capital a little too close from the border, that's true... But the North Korean can't send them to high heaven out of nowhere... and besides, what can they do after that? Send hordes of technically inferior soldiers (although I find out their Air Force and Army Heavy Equipment Formidable) against an extremely modern army, backed up by one of the most powerful military forces in the world? I mean they're crazy, but I believe they're not suicidal...

They have the fifth largest military in the world, plus there using ak-47/74 thoose weapons if used by someone trained properly are just as goods as sa80's M16 M4

And it could be more of a test to see how much they can get away with before the UN or the States step in, but they know that the States is tied up in Iraq, so if there's any time to strike anybody, it would be now

leewatson1 wrote:They have the fifth largest military in the world, plus there using ak-47/74 thoose weapons if used by someone trained properly are just as goods as sa80's M16 M4

Exactly well trained... and the part were they have the 5th largest army in the world... well... they count militia as part of the army, did you knew that? There they've over 3.5 million voluntaries, most of them only armed with katanas...

While we're throwing "facts" around about their army like no it alls, how about we post some sources here?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_People's_Army wrote:Paramilitary units

[edit]Worker-Peasant Red Guard
The Worker-Peasant Red Guard (WPRG) is the largest civilian defense force in the DPRK with a strength of approximately 3.5 million.[21] The militia is organised on a provincial/ town/ village level, and structured on a brigade, battalion, company, and platoon basis. The militia maintains infantry small arms, with some mortars and anti-aircraft guns, although some units are unarmed.[22] The WPRG is 51 years old, having been established in 1959 and is not only under National Defense Commission control, but is also attached to the Worker's Party of Korea under its Department of Civil Defense.

Happy?

Yes Thing with civilian militia is in a lot of those countries, they can't be underestimated. I mean look at Darfur, it's a fair mess over there and it's because mainly of guys on horses with guns and knives. I think even if the US sent in its modernized army, they would have a difficult time. Look at Vietnam for example. The problem with modernized warfare is that people like the States expects others to play by the same rules with the advanced machinery and weaponry. However, in a bunch of countries such as N Korea, where these people know the terrain better and are much sneakier fighters, they could give the States a run for its money. Unless of course it nuked N Korea, but that would have a massive political backlash

Also, North Korea isn't the 5th... it's the 4th:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_People's_Army wrote:
North Korea is the most militarized country in the world today,[4] having the fourth largest army in the world, at about 1,106,000 armed personnel, with about 20% of men ages 17–54 in the regular armed forces.[5] It also has a reserve force comprising 8,200,000 personnel. It operates an enormous network of military facilities scattered around the country, a large weapons production basis, a dense air defense system, the third largest chemical weapons stockpile in the world,[6] and includes the largest Special Forces contingent (numbering 180,000 men).

But I still would prefer being a soldier in the South than in the North...

@DW... In the case that the North invaded the South, it would be hard to repeal it back... The best option for the states is to carpet bomb everything in the North, destroy their limited navy and reduce it's airforce to nothing... and then maybe there could be a decent chance of making them give up due to starvation...

But again, political backlash and the States definitely won't do something like that unless they absolutely have to. No, there's more chances of the North invading the South and the States leaving the South to figure it out. With this whole Middle East venture, both the States and UN are too occupied to be able to put a significant enough foothold in Korea

True, but with the attempt from retreating from Afghanistan and Iraq, and with the new partnership along side Russia, there might have more reasons to believe otherwise...

But then we also have South Korea's closest Allie (at least in geagraphic situation), Japan, which has the 2nd largest fleet in the pacific, that might have an huge impact...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan_Maritime_Self-Defense_Force#JMSDF_Fleet wrote:The JMSDF has an official strength of 46,000 personnel (currently around 45,800 personnel), operating some 110 major warships, including 2 helicopter carriers, 18 submarines, 47 destroyers and frigates, 29 mine warfare ships, 9 patrol craft and 9 amphibious ships (total displacement of approx. 432,000 tons)[2]. It also has 179 fixed-wing aircraft and 135 helicopters. Most of these aircraft are used in antisubmarine and mine warfare operations.

And remember that North Korea's Navy is only a Green Water navy...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_People's_Army wrote:The Korean People's Naval Command - more commonly known as the Korean People's Navy (KPN) - is a green-water navy and operates mainly within the 50 kilometer exclusion zone. The KPN is the lowest priority military service and most of its equipment is obsolete. As at 2007 the KPN comprised 46,000 personnel and operated 704 ships and landing and infiltration craft. The navy also operates a large number of coastal defence units which are equipped with artillery and surface-to-surface missiles.[15]

Though remember it was N Korea I believe who test fired that missile over Japan. To me, it looks like they're trying to figure out the best way of fighting a war without ever leaving their doorstep.

But remember also, that you can't start throwing stuff to your neighbors lawn without them return to reclaim about it...

It would be an instant before the Japanese Navy, the American Navy and Korean Navy arrived there... and that would mean a very huge blockade to break through... unless they nuked them... and that would give the US the motives they would need to bring them back to Stone Age...

But the question is, would they? I mean Japan explicitly threatened N Korea to not fire the missile but they did anyways. And what did Japan do? Nothing. That's what's been going on the whole time, the bigger powers keep telling N Korea to not do stuff for the repercussions would be bad, but N Korea does it anyways and what does everyone else do? Nothing. N Korea's testing the waters like I said before and it's turning out that they can get away with quite a bit.

Darkwing wrote:But the question is, would they? I mean Japan explicitly threatened N Korea to not fire the missile but they did anyways. And what did Japan do? Nothing. That's what's been going on the whole time, the bigger powers keep telling N Korea to not do stuff for the repercussions would be bad, but N Korea does it anyways and what does everyone else do? Nothing. N Korea's testing the waters like I said before and it's turning out that they can get away with quite a bit.

That's true... But there's gonna be a time were they will cross the line... and that could (I said could) turn pretty bad against them...

Maybe. Do remember this though, other countries don't get involved (even if they're allies) unless they absolutely have to. Because quite honestly, I really think N Korea could and most likely will invade S Korea and nobody will intervene, at least not until the conflict effects someone else in drastic enough sense. If you even look through recent history, that's sort of how things play out. The States especially, unless it directly involves or effects them, they won't become involved.
On top of that, even if/when the States pull out of the Middle East, they've suffered considerable causalities and are in a large amount of debt over it. They don't want to go fight another war unless they absolutely must.
And the UN isn't a war machine really. They're more focuses on larger, global concerns, crimes against humanity and the like. Canada isn't really an offensive force, we'll go fight to defend, but we're quite reluctant to do so. Japan might intervene, but only if they feel threatened. Plus, there's the big worry that if somebody like Japan or the States step in, what is China going to do?

Oh an another thought, even if the States wanted to go to war with them with the UN's aid, China would most likely veto the decision. Again I go back to the Darfur case.

Well... I guess China feels the same... They would only intervene if it affected them... And I think that China wouldn't want to declare war to the States, since it's their biggest source of income in the entire world...

And yes... When N. Korea invades, S. Korea would be pretty much alone, unless they convinced the Japanese to enter in the war and keep China away from it...

And thats true... China would veto it... That's one of the worse parts of the security council, but we must say it prevented many wars...

It's also prevented much aid to countries that need it and not even in war efforts. Like the States can't offer any assistance to stopping the rids in Darfur because China keeps vetoing the vote because China is getting oil I do believe. Mind you, I haven't kept up on the situation in the last year or so.

The US isn't that lazy. If they find one of their most significant allies in Asia being invaded by a bunch of crazies armed with sticks, they'll withdraw their units in Afghanistan and ship them off to Korea. And China wouldn't do anything, at all. If they went to war with a western nation and forced America's hand, they wouldn't have anyone to sell all their crap to. Even if they win the war in Korea and unite it under the North, they'd be without anyone to sell all the stuff their industry produces, and most western countries would probably relocate all their production to India or Pakistan or whatever country has cheap enough labor. They'd end up broke again. I really doubt they'd risk losing all their economic success to save some insignificant moron's arse from being shot to pieces.

Oh, and NATO can just disregard the UN. The UN would probably just whine a bit then go back to whining about other things without actually doing anything to improve the world.

Thingy wrote:The US isn't that lazy. If they find one of their most significant allies in Asia being invaded by a bunch of crazies armed with sticks, they'll withdraw their units in Afghanistan and ship them off to Korea. And China wouldn't do anything, at all. If they went to war with a western nation and forced America's hand, they wouldn't have anyone to sell all their crap to. Even if they win the war in Korea and unite it under the North, they'd be without anyone to sell all the stuff their industry produces, and most western countries would probably relocate all their production to India or Pakistan or whatever country has cheap enough labor. They'd end up broke again. I really doubt they'd risk losing all their economic success to save some insignificant moron's arse from being shot to pieces.

The thing with China is pretty much nobody knows what their strategic situation is. Like what if in the off, sci-fi chance China won and beat out the United States and became the worlds new dominant super power. Selling stuff to the States wouldn't be any benefit anymore anyways. If anything, the rest of the world needs China more than China needs the rest of the world. Because we're the ones buying the product, if there's no more product for us to buy than we (especially the States) are quite screwed. In fact, (don't quote me on this) but isn't a good chunk of the parts used in the States' military actually built by Chinese and whatnot?

And to clarify, no, China won't get involved unless the other major powers of the world do. Except the thing with China is they're more apt to wait for everyone to blast each other to pieces, wait for the dust to settle and then suddenly appear on top.

Darkwing wrote:And to clarify, no, China won't get involved unless the other major powers of the world do. Except the thing with China is they're more apt to wait for everyone to blast each other to pieces, wait for the dust to settle and then suddenly appear on top.

I remember that was how the United States Rose to the Status of SuperPower... By letting the rest of the world blow each other and then appear on the top...

Oh, China is going to be in the next generation of superpowers, that's already pretty much set in stone. They know that, and they're not going to risk going back to being broke and not even having a shot at becoming a super power just to help a bunch of brainwashed morons who are begging for a fight.

China's a great place for production, but they're not the only country with alot of people desperate for work and ready to accept bread crumbs in return for work. It might cost a bit, but all the major corporations can just move their production to eastern Europe or some other Asian country with a large, poor population if the government forces them to abandon China, or if they're forced by China.

And no, the military isn't that dumb, they make sure everything is of the highest quality, and produced in their own country by a corporation they trust.

Ok, that's good, like I said, I wasn't sure on that point.

The problem with moving production elsewhere is costs. A country like Canada, we're more used to in-house production, though still most of the stuff is made in Taiwan. But that's actually due to mostly American corporations such as Wal-Mart becoming more and more prevalent in Canadian business.

Darkwing wrote:Ok, that's good, like I said, I wasn't sure on that point.

The problem with moving production elsewhere is costs. A country like Canada, we're more used to in-house production, though still most of the stuff is made in Taiwan. But that's actually due to mostly American corporations such as Wal-Mart becoming more and more prevalent in Canadian business.

Well... I guess that we can replace China by any other, as long as it is viable... Else it's no use, and can actually crash the world economy...

We'd have some economic backlash, but after a couple of years, the only difference is that china is going to be without a good source of income and in a recession, and India (which by the way is an ally and a democracy) will have a better economy.